Same Song--Different Year

**CHUQ** · Agitator Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts votes: 3

This is a little something I wrote about a year ago when the immigration thing was being to be a heated topic.

What Is New With The Immigration Thing?

NOT A G*DD*MN THING! Does that answer the f*cking question? Every agrument that is being made today has been made in the past. Let me say that again, EVERY argument that is being made today has been made in the past. I have tried to be neutral in this, but enough is enough! I am personally, sick of the sanctimonious bullshit!

When exactly was that? I am glas you asked! About 30 years ago we had an influx of immigrants, they were called refugees and not illegals and guess what the same objections were voiced then as now. They will take American jobs. They will be a drain on society. They do not speak english. They are demanding benefits without pay their dues for the priviledge. Yada, f*cking yada.

Who are these people that I am accusing of this? The Vietnamese! Maybe you are too young to recall, but nothing been said is NEW! Back in the day, everybody had an opinion. I guess about the only difference was the wording of the description of the people. They were refugees. Today the people are called illegals. The wording is everything. It is more politically correct to use illegals and it makes for good fodder for the talk shows. Other than that there is NO difference.

How do I know all this? I lived through it! I do not need Google to refresh my memory. As a Vietnam vet I was one of the opponents of the mass influxion of 'refugees'. I saw them recieve all sorts of perks for coming here; perks that as a Viet vet I could not get. As a matter of fact, the Viets were given free shrimp boats and free gas so that they could become useful residents of the Coast. Local shrimpers were pissed, they started saying that they would starve because the government did not care about their plight. Several really ugly confrontations were gonna happen. Does any of this sound familiar? Well, no one starved to death and eventually all learned to play nice with each other. I was vocal and I was dead set against them coming to this country. Even to this day, my town has an on call linguist because not all Vietnamese speak english. Even today, In my town there are bi-lingual signs, etc, does not seem to be a problem, so why is a sign in Spanish a problem. The Viets were not forced to become citizens and some to this day still are not. The younger ones became citizens but not all the parents. Do you people that are yelling the loudest about the drawbacks of all the Mexicans worried about the others? F*ck No! You learned to live with it. Do it again!

As with the Vietnamese, the problem the US is facing now, will be just fine. Last the mexicans are working from day one, most of the time. It was not so with the Vietnamese, but it all worked out in the wash and the Vietnamese became valued members of American society. It will be the same again! This immigration thing is just away to keepd the American people focused on something besides the declining quality of life in this country. It is working and you people are letting it succeed.

The Mexicans like the Viets are hard working people and that should be all that concerns anyone. But NOOOOOOO! You have to turn this into an ugly debate that is not and will not solve the problem.

So yes, I have an opinion and it does and did not matter. Mine like yours does not matter. All I can say is, welcome to the f*cking debate!

CHUQ
03/03/06

**Tumbleweed** · Admin Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts votes: 4

The difference I see between the the Vietnamese and the Hispanics is the numbers.

The number from Mexico is somewhere between 7-12 million.

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The first arrivals: As Saigon fell to the communists, some 135,000 Vietnamese fled to America. These were mainly ex-military and government officials, Vietnamese who had worked for the U.S. during the war and their families. Initially, they came to four U.S. military bases in California, Arkansas, Pennsylvania, and Florida. Several national voluntary agencies, under contract from the Department of State, resettled these new arrivals in communities throughout the country and arranged "sponsorships" for the refugees. These sponsorships involved the provision of housing and initial support from interested Americans.

Source

I agree, the arguement against letting them into the county is the same.

Then there is the security risk of allowing the Hispanics to just walk into our country. Nobody walked here from Viet Nam. Laughing

The immigation problem we face today has more to do with security than than being a burden on our social services, although it a problem to a certain degree in a few places in the country.IMO.

**Meme** · Associate Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts votes: 1

I guess one of my big issues with illegals (or refugees) is the services and programs of all the help they receive. As I stated in a PREVIOUS POST, for the most part these people are receiving benefits and "perks" that most Americans are not eligible for. While seeing what was going on in the housing units I lived in during the 80's - the Vietnamese "refugees" receiving every kind of help available, and taking full advantage of them, I also saw Americans barely able to feed their children, or pay for much needed medical care for their children. All the while, the VN people didn't have to worry about such things! They didn't even need to worry about how to pay for the appointments or the medicine, or how to get those appointments - they received rides to and from the appointments, while brand new Trans Am's etc sat in their driveways.

So, am I bitter? I guess so... I don't see things as fair and they need to be changed. Someone coming illegally into our country should not be given a free ride when Americans are being treated like crap. I'm not saying how the Vietnamese came here was illegal, I'm not quite sure what their stories were, but with the Mexicans who are walking across the border, there definitely needs to be some change! For all illegals!

**CHUQ** · Agitator Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts votes: 3

All i am saying is that everything being said about "illegals" has been said before, the Vietnamese, the Cubans and maybe even back in the early days of immigration, it was said about the Irish.
\
Ok, ask yourself, with so many Iraqi rrefugees and if the US said bring on, what would be said about their entrance into the country.

**Tumbleweed** · Admin Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts votes: 4

I agree Chuq, it's all been said before. Given the large number of illegals coming from Mexico, I don't think we could handle the refugees from Iraq that would be needed to make a difference in the plight the Iraqi's face.

**Meme** · Associate Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts votes: 1

So, forgive my ignorance on this issue, but have we begun to accept the Iraqi's or are we planning to?

Embarassed

**Tumbleweed** · Admin Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts votes: 4

I haven't been following the numbers but it seems to be a drop in the bucket compared to the rufugees we created in Iraq. I'll see if I can find the latest figures.

**CHUQ** · Agitator Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts votes: 3

Keep in mind that the US did not get all the Viet refugees. You picked and chose from those in camps in the region. There is the prob, we are not in control of who comes now.

**trivium666fan** · Soldier Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts votes: 2

I am a hispanic, and unlike most of my fellow hispanics, I oppose the whole illegal immigration of peopel into this country. One thing I do is know is that it is incredibly hard to become a resident or citizen of this country, especially for people from Mexico(Since the government down there literally takes their sweet-ass time to give you legal papers).

That is still no excuse to break the law. I don't really believe that the illegal immigrants in this nation are that much of a problem as they are made out to be. But I am still a strong law-abider(for the most part, hehehe). Laws are put in place for a reason, and not to break them!

Personally, my ideas are too drastic to be allowed, but would definitely work...still...too drastic. Not even worth mentioning, haha. But illegal immigration should be stopped. And people's repitition of old and over-used and out-dated excuses are becoming too easily dissmissed because of their constant usage.

**Tumbleweed** · Admin Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts votes: 4

Quote:

Personally, my ideas are too drastic to be allowed, but would definitely work...still...too drastic. Not even worth mentioning

I'd still like to hear them. My stand isn't all that popular either.

**trivium666fan** · Soldier Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts votes: 2

Tumbleweed wrote:

I'd still like to hear them. My stand isn't all that popular either.

My ideas are mostly opposed by every single person I have ever told.

IDEA 1- Create a larger force protecting the border to insure security more than racism against hispanics or stopping illegal immigrants. Then, creating a separate system where those who are in line for citizenship or residency can be sped up(not allowing anymore people to start signing up, more like put on a waiting list). After helping the first group, the waiting list people will be helped. After that is said and done, anyone who is not legally here can be helped into becoming a resident or citizen. Basically, make everyone legal and try to stop as many incomers as possible.

IDEA 2- Completely shut down entrance to the U.S. for a certain amount of time(obviously warning citizens and residents that it will happen so no one leaves and then can't come back). Tehn, taking the pre-determined amount of time to deal with the illegal immigrants that are already here(again, obviously in a moral and lawful way).

IDEA 3- Make agreements with Mexico where their citizens could be allowed to visit the country but on monitored occasions where Mexico can keep track o those leaving the country. This would stop anyone from actually calling themselves illegal, and anyone with a job will gain rights in this country. These rights will sotp companies from exploiting them here, which would eventually stop them from hiring people simply for being illegal(we all know they do it because they know they can pay them less and not be attacked for it as long as they don't get caught). If more illegals cannot be hired, and are given a voice of representation in this country, no one will consider them, and they will have no ability to stay here.

I forgot a few other ones that I have, but I know they will be just as easily rejected as these. My ideas are usually too extreme and drastic to be considered, but I know they can eventually work if done properly.

**Tumbleweed** · Admin Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts votes: 4

I think the problem might be you are relying on Mexico to do their part. The illegals are a big cash cow so any help from them will only be minimal at best.

I'll discuss small parts of your plan at a time.

Quote:

Create a larger force protecting the border to insure security

I agree. The problem is nobody wants to fund it so we don't have the resources.

Quote:

Then, creating a separate system where those who are in line for citizenship or residency can be sped up(not allowing anymore people to start signing up, more like put on a waiting list).

I agree

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anyone who is not legally here can be helped into becoming a resident or citizen. Basically, make everyone legal and try to stop as many incomers as possible.

We did that in 86, and it didn't work.

**Rupchuk** · Moderator Thanks: 0 Thanked 3 Times in 3 Posts votes: 4

I agree with some of what you said CHUQ. I think that some of the arguments against immigration aren't true but there are some reasons I've got problems with immigrantion.

First of all I have a problem with the federal government giving public funds to immigrants so they can start up their own businesses and such. What the hell is up with that? For my wife I have to sign a document saying that basically I can provide for her so that she isn't a burden on anyone else but me. So I have to be able to provide for her but the government doesn't, that's fine but other immigrants getting grants from the government? Bump that.

Second of all I have to pay time and money for her to legally come here. I don't mind that either, except that others can hop the border or drift on a raft and they don't have to pay those fees and they still get the same services that my wife will be entitled to when she gets here.

I'm abiding by the law and I'm getting shafted while these illegals, refugees, whatever you want to call them are breaking the law with little if any consequence.

**trivium666fan** · Soldier Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts votes: 2

Rupchuk wrote:

I'm abiding by the law and I'm getting shafted while these illegals, refugees, whatever you want to call them are breaking the law with little if any consequence.

Thats my biggest concern with all this. They break the law and are treated the same as any law-abiding immigrant... It deserves punishment. They are criminals and deserve to be treated as such.

**CHUQ** · Agitator Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts votes: 3

I agree with everyone that they are all criminally responsible for what they are doing. But on the same note, if you were starving and had no work and you had a country a few miles a way what would you do to feed and clothe your family.

I am not saying that illegal immigrattion is right, just I would personally break the law too to assit my family. Hell when my grandfather was a young man and he was caught off the Rez, he was an illegal immigrant. Legally it is wrong, morally it is right.